[Old Car Nut]

Hello. We had a third gen Rav4 which was rear ended and totaled during a recent snow event. We're looking to go down in size as we are now empty nesters and don't need that much room. We also haven't been driving our Rav4 that much - we've averaged only a couple of thousand miles each of the last few years so don't want to put a lot of money into a subcompact SUV that will primarily be driven sparingly around town and mostly on a few road trips a year. We have an electric car for around town driving and a sports car when we have a need for speed. We're retired so no need to commute.

Our Rav4 had the 269 HP V6 and that was perfect as it allowed us to do high speed driving up and over mountains and in the wide spaces near the west coast where we live. Prior to the Rav4, we had a Previa and then an Odyssey, so we went from 138 to 240 and then to 269 HP. It's hard to envision going backwards but the CX-30 is too small and anything else with more power than the Seltos is $20k more.

So a few questions about the Seltos. How is it for extended high speed cruising, like in the 80-90 MPH range including up in the mountains? Any problems with engine overheating when climbing passes and fully loaded? Does 91/93 octane fuel benefit the power output? Is there a known shop that can retune the engine to produce the higher power levels it generates in other applications?

Also, is there any aftermarket support for suspension components, such as higher rate sway bars or chassis stiffening braces? Has anyone changed out the original 235/45-18 tires for 215/50-18?

And lastly, is the grey seating material a normal grey color or does it have shades or tones of beige? If we were to get that color, is it only the seats or are there any interior trim pieces that are also grey?

Thanks for any help and answers you can provide!

 

[Old Car Nut]

We had our first chance to sit in and drive an SX today. It has confirmed this is the way we're going to go.

A new question - it appears parts of the interior, like the pillars and roof, are already a light grey color. On the Kia website, it appears the grey seat material is a darker and more beige color than the roof and pillar material. Can someone who has a grey SX interior confirm if the seats and the other grey interior panels are the same?

 

[TheWasteHandler]

Hey there! As someone who is looking at getting am SX as well, I too am curious of a few of the things you touched base on in your initial post... Im curious about the aspect of a tune, cold air intake and minor things like that for these to increase the power a tad. But at the same time, I know this is a complete opposite of what I'm driving now - a '12 Buick Regal GS Stage 1 with 295HP and 335lbs/ft of torque (basically, as close to a new Grand National as your gonna get...). But after having test driven the SX Saturday, I'm impressed with it and would be happy with it as a new daily driver.

To answer some of your questions in a more general sense:
*Fuel: It will always help running a higher grade fuel... the higher octane fuel will burn a lot cleaner, keeping things like the valves cleaner (if it's not a direct injected motor...) as well as keep emissions cleaner. (I have run super in everything I've owned. And in the case of the '98 S10 pickup I had, it passed 2 different state emissions testing 3x, with what I didn't know at the time was a hollowed out catalytic converter!!!) It should definitely get you better mileage as a result of a cleaner and more efficient burn, any added power as a result is usually doubtful...

*Overheating issue(s): Not with the engine, but there's numerous posts in this forum about the transmission overheating. And the overheating issue is mainly in stop and go, bumper-to-bumper traffic. Apparently the dual clutch setup will wind up overheating in those conditions because the clutches are still always engaged. I would check out some of the posts in the "Complaints, issues & problems" thread on here for more info... And the other issue with the transmission tends to be that it will wind up selecting even gears and not odd (or vise versa...), which apparently there's a transmission control module programming update that's supposed to solve that issue...

Suspension: I don't know if there's any kind of upgrades like your thinking of to beef up the stock setup, but someone did mention that there is a lift kit for these trucks... Im doubting that your looking for something that extreme though...

Hope this helps even a little bit... I wish I could comment more, but the truck I am seriously considering is an SX in Mars Orange and with a black interior... Good luck!!

 

[Xcalibur255]

If you live in a major metro area and experience heavy rush hour traffic there is a very real danger of the DCT overheating in stop and go traffic. The clutch isn't designed to simulate the "creep" of a traditional automatic for long periods of time, it has to stay in a slipping condition to do this and generates heat in the clutches. This is the only situation where you are likely to have to worry about it.

As for fuel grade, I've owned two vehicles with this 1.6T engine and I can tell you that it does respond to changes in fuel octane. There is a lot of active management of ignition timing advance in these turbo engines to prevent knock, and typically a higher grade of fuel will allow the engine to advance the timing a little bit once it is "used" to the new octane, but the difference isn't dramatic and honestly is not worth paying the extra fuel price for. The additional spark advance gives you a bit more power and can alter the feel of the engine's power curve, but the changes are not large or dramatic. It's also inconsistent as there are a lot of variables that control this behavior. What's more noticeably, IMO, is the effect it has on throttle response. Running premium fuel makes the throttle response snappier and more eager. I actually don't like this, it makes the car feel nervous and more difficult to drive smoothly, but if you are heavy footed and prefer a snappy response from the car then you'll probably find the effect more agreeable.

I would expect wind noise to be pretty substantial at 90MPH (!) so be prepared for that. Also, you will want to pay attention to how the car behaves when the cruise control is engaged. Mine acts very strangely and feels gutless when using the cruise. It will downshift and labor going up hills as if the turbo were dead and couldn't make boost. I have had the car running in 4th gear turning 5,000RPM driving into a headwind and as soon as I turned the cruise control off it will shift back up to 7th and hum right along on boost. This behavior is VERY strange and is by far the thing I hate most about my car. I have a working theory that the computer module for the radar cruise is from a different car that doesn't use a turbocharged engine and is following a different shift and throttle pattern. I've wondered if maybe this was done as a part substitution because of all the chip shortages and only some Seltos models are like this because I have yet to run into another person who has this specific complaint. My Seltos feels like crap out on the highway with the cruise on though, as if it has less than 100 HP. It is constantly shifting for even small grades when it absolutely has the power to pull them.

 

[Old Car Nut]

Hey there! As someone who is looking at getting am SX as well, I too am curious of a few of the things you touched base on in your initial post... Im curious about the aspect of a tune, cold air intake and minor things like that for these to increase the power a tad. But at the same time, I know this is a complete opposite of what I'm driving now - a '12 Buick Regal GS Stage 1 with 295HP and 335lbs/ft of torque (basically, as close to a new Grand National as your gonna get...). But after having test driven the SX Saturday, I'm impressed with it and would be happy with it as a new daily driver.

To answer some of your questions in a more general sense:
*Fuel: It will always help running a higher grade fuel... the higher octane fuel will burn a lot cleaner, keeping things like the valves cleaner (if it's not a direct injected motor...) as well as keep emissions cleaner. (I have run super in everything I've owned. And in the case of the '98 S10 pickup I had, it passed 2 different state emissions testing 3x, with what I didn't know at the time was a hollowed out catalytic converter!!!) It should definitely get you better mileage as a result of a cleaner and more efficient burn, any added power as a result is usually doubtful...

*Overheating issue(s): Not with the engine, but there's numerous posts in this forum about the transmission overheating. And the overheating issue is mainly in stop and go, bumper-to-bumper traffic. Apparently the dual clutch setup will wind up overheating in those conditions because the clutches are still always engaged. I would check out some of the posts in the "Complaints, issues & problems" thread on here for more info... And the other issue with the transmission tends to be that it will wind up selecting even gears and not odd (or vise versa...), which apparently there's a transmission control module programming update that's supposed to solve that issue...

Suspension: I don't know if there's any kind of upgrades like your thinking of to beef up the stock setup, but someone did mention that there is a lift kit for these trucks... Im doubting that your looking for something that extreme though...

Hope this helps even a little bit... I wish I could comment more, but the truck I am seriously considering is an SX in Mars Orange and with a black interior... Good luck!!

We only had a short test drive with a brand new SX so I both wasn't sure the oil was fully warmed up and just not wanting to give full throttle to a car with that few miles on it. It doesn't feel as effortlessly powerful at part throttle as our v6 Rav4 though part of that may be due to the Rav's more aggressive throttle mapping early in the pedal travel. The absolute numbers of 60-100 MPH acceleration are about 15% slower than in our Rav so we're expecting it to be working a bit harder at higher speeds, but it should still be adequate as we rarely used that last 15% except for passing.

I believe this same engine/turbo combo makes 195 and 201 HP in different applications so it's like Kia made some changes to enhance low RPM torque over high RPM horsepower. On other vehicles, like the CX-30 with the turbo, that engine makes 227 HP with 87 octane and 250 HP with 91/93 octane. Our Rav4's naturally aspirated engine doesn't specify any changes in output with different gasoline but there's a consistent change in behavior depending on whether we're running 87 or 91/93 octane. There's a slight freeway incline that we always use the cruise control on and with 87 octane, the transmission always unlocks on that stretch whereas with 91/93 octane, it makes it up that grade without unlocking. I have to admit that it's going to take a fair amount of dissatisfaction to want to void the powertrain warranty with a tune, but I'd like that alternative since we're going down so much in power.

I am aware of the overheating issue with the transmission. We're both retired so no commuting in our future, and if we run into heavy traffic on our road trips we'll just pull over and explore where ever we are. We do plan a lot of driving on dirt roads to trailheads but nothing that would require extreme slow speed creeping. It's not as quick shifting as I would have thought but definitely adequate for an SUV vehicle. The transmission shifted well during our short test drive but the programming is too economy oriented. We will probably use the sport mode a fair amount.

There's a bit more body lean than I'd prefer, especially during transitional maneuvers, but the spring rates feel pretty hefty. It feels like higher rate sway bars front and rear will help balance things out, and help the shocks a bit as well. Combined with downsizing to 215/50-18 and a good alignment, I think I can get it to handle the way I'd like. We're willing to live with a little less off-road capability to get a fairly significant increase in on-road behavior.

I know I'm an extreme outlier with what I'm hoping to do, and what we're looking for can be found in a vehicle like a Porsche Macan. I tried to get my wife into one a few years back but she didn't want to give up the Rav. For as little as we're thinking we'll be driving this vehicle, it doesn't make sense to pour a ton of money into it. That being said, we're still going to look at the X1/X2, XC40, Q3, and some other competitors. But we really do prefer the size and packaging of the Seltos more than that next level up.

Good luck with your Seltos decision!

 

[Old Car Nut]

If you live in a major metro area and experience heavy rush hour traffic there is a very real danger of the DCT overheating in stop and go traffic. The clutch isn't designed to simulate the "creep" of a traditional automatic for long periods of time, it has to stay in a slipping condition to do this and generates heat in the clutches. This is the only situation where you are likely to have to worry about it.

As for fuel grade, I've owned two vehicles with this 1.6T engine and I can tell you that it does respond to changes in fuel octane. There is a lot of active management of ignition timing advance in these turbo engines to prevent knock, and typically a higher grade of fuel will allow the engine to advance the timing a little bit once it is "used" to the new octane, but the difference isn't dramatic and honestly is not worth paying the extra fuel price for. The additional spark advance gives you a bit more power and can alter the feel of the engine's power curve, but the changes are not large or dramatic. It's also inconsistent as there are a lot of variables that control this behavior. What's more noticeably, IMO, is the effect it has on throttle response. Running premium fuel makes the throttle response snappier and more eager. I actually don't like this, it makes the car feel nervous and more difficult to drive smoothly, but if you are heavy footed and prefer a snappy response from the car then you'll probably find the effect more agreeable.

I would expect wind noise to be pretty substantial at 90MPH (!) so be prepared for that. Also, you will want to pay attention to how the car behaves when the cruise control is engaged. Mine acts very strangely and feels gutless when using the cruise. It will downshift and labor going up hills as if the turbo were dead and couldn't make boost. I have had the car running in 4th gear turning 5,000RPM driving into a headwind and as soon as I turned the cruise control off it will shift back up to 7th and hum right along on boost. This behavior is VERY strange and is by far the thing I hate most about my car. I have a working theory that the computer module for the radar cruise is from a different car that doesn't use a turbocharged engine and is following a different shift and throttle pattern. I've wondered if maybe this was done as a part substitution because of all the chip shortages and only some Seltos models are like this because I have yet to run into another person who has this specific complaint. My Seltos feels like crap out on the highway with the cruise on though, as if it has less than 100 HP. It is constantly shifting for even small grades when it absolutely has the power to pull them.

We're in one of the worst traffic areas in the nation (Seattle, Washington suburbs) but fortunately don't have to commute. I did commute for a few years in a manual transmission vehicle (a first generation Miata) and I know I wouldn't want to subject the Seltos to that kind of clutch abuse!

So it sounds like the Seltos also can take advantage of the higher octane! Engines are most prone to pinging at low RPM and high load, and that seems to be where the transmission programming wants to put the Seltos the majority of the time. I do have some questions about the manual shift mode of the transmission though. If it is in manual mode, will it automatically upshift at redline and downshift if the engine speed gets too low? Can the cruise control be used when in manual shift mode? Maybe that can help with your issue, but I agree with you that it should not do that. But I will definitely use the cruise to see if I have that same issue. There are a lot of rolling hills and mountain passes where we live.

I have heard of owners with other vehicles who have experienced wind noise around door seals that have partially or almost fully fixed the problem by adding another layer of foam gasket to the inside of the OEM door seal, basically doubling the thickness of the gasket. I know we'll have that need - driving around in the desert Southwest, there are just so many wide stretches where the average speeds are in the higher double digits and lower triple digits. We last drove from San Francisco to the Indian Wells area in 2017 and averaged nearly 100 MPH over about a 50 mile stretch and averaged over 85 MPH for much of the rest of the freeway drive, and we were by far not the fastest. We also were in Colorado this past August and drove up to 14000 feet elevation a couple of times so that's why having enough power is important to us. We had a rental car for the Colorado trip and it was pretty miserable.

 

[Old Car Nut]

Oh, another question! Has anyone done a four wheel alignment with their Seltos SX? Is camber adjustable at every wheel?

And anyone with the grey seating surfaces, just to confirm that the color of the seat itself and the color of the headliner and pillars are different. It seems that the headliner/pillars are a light grey and the seats are more beige/creme.

 

[Xcalibur255]

It has struts at all corners so I would assume the rear camber is adjustable. This is only applicable to the SX Turbo though, the cheaper Seltos trims do not have independent rear suspension, where as the SX model does.

I have actually never held a gear to redline in the manual shift mode so I don't actually know if it holds there at the limiter or auto-upshifts. It will auto-downshift if your RPM gets too low in manual mode. Also, yes you can put it in manual shift mode with the cruise engaged including the radar cruise. It doesn't seem to care. It also doesn't really solve the problem. Instead of downshift the car will simply lose speed on hills. The insane part is you can put your foot on the gas and gain the speed back while still climbing that hill, all of this taking place in 7th gear. I actually strongly suspect that my car has the wrong PCM chip from another Hyundai/Kia vehicle otherwise I think other people would have complained about this before I did. Trying to convince a dealership of that would be a fools errand though (I can see "system operates normally, no fault found" comments on the work order sheet in my mind right now). So I've resigned myself to live with it.

You might have a tough time finding the grey seat option, it was rare in the 2021 model year. I wanted it and had to give up on it. There is technically also a plum colored seat available too but it too seems rare.

 

[Old Car Nut]

It has struts at all corners so I would assume the rear camber is adjustable. This is only applicable to the SX Turbo though, the cheaper Seltos trims do not have independent rear suspension, where as the SX model does.

I have actually never held a gear to redline in the manual shift mode so I don't actually know if it holds there at the limiter or auto-upshifts. It will auto-downshift if your RPM gets too low in manual mode. Also, yes you can put it in manual shift mode with the cruise engaged including the radar cruise. It doesn't seem to care. It also doesn't really solve the problem. Instead of downshift the car will simply lose speed on hills. The insane part is you can put your foot on the gas and gain the speed back while still climbing that hill, all of this taking place in 7th gear. I actually strongly suspect that my car has the wrong PCM chip from another Hyundai/Kia vehicle otherwise I think other people would have complained about this before I did. Trying to convince a dealership of that would be a fools errand though (I can see "system operates normally, no fault found" comments on the work order sheet in my mind right now). So I've resigned myself to live with it.

You might have a tough time finding the grey seat option, it was rare in the 2021 model year. I wanted it and had to give up on it. There is technically also a plum colored seat available too but it too seems rare.

I would also assume that rear camber is adjustable due to the independent rear. It's nice to be able to fine tune the driving experience in that way.

We tend to use the cruise fairly extensively when the roads are flat and straight but I always manually control the throttle when in the mountains or when the roads are curvy so hopefully the cruise functioning won't be a problem for me. I'm curious to hear if you ever get any resolution to your problems.

We've decided against the grey seat option, and the plum was a non-starter. The grey is more cream colored and it doesn't match the headliner and pillars which are a light grey. From all the photos I've seen, it's close enough but also not close enough so a person would tend to go "Huh?" and wonder if it was supposed to match and just didn't. We're going to go with the black seating surfaces.

I've confirmed with my local race shop that as long as I can provide them with a sway bar, they can replicate the bends and create a higher rate pair that is within about 15% of the bending stiffness I'm wanting, for less than a thousand bucks.

I've also found this:

Performance chips – Chip tuning by RaceChip for Kia Seltos 1.6 T-GDI (129KW) | RaceChip

Chip tuning from RaceChip for your Kia Seltos 1.6 T-GDI (129KW). Experience the true potential and power of your KIA.

www.racechip.us

It looks like this upgrade voids the factory engine warranty so they provide a short duration replacement warranty. I'm also unsure if the current cooling is able to handle the thermal load of a potential 30% horsepower increase, without enhancing the coolant radiator and adding extra oil cooling capacity. Also unknown at this point is how much power the clutch can handle, and how much a big power increase will shorten the life of the engine, even if used relatively sparingly.

We should be placing our order for an SX tomorrow.

 

[ALAP]

I have a Seltos with 30K on it. Never had an issue with mountains (Blue Ridge and Smoky Mountains) The turbo model has all the pep I need. Note on octane. With this type of vehicle (and others) the system is programed and tuned for 87 octane. What many don't realize is the higher the octane the quicker the burn. The PCU doesn't know what octane is burning and in fact, the vehicle may run like crap with a higher octane. Missfires, knock, skips, lower power. I assure you that these facts are true and the car is designed/engineered for a certain octane level for performance, mileage, and power. I am a retired Molecular Chemist and have actually did some research on this exact subject. If you'd like, and I can find it, I can send some papers I co-authored on the subject. Thanks

 

[Driven1]

Hello. We had a third gen Rav4 which was rear ended and totaled during a recent snow event. We're looking to go down in size as we are now empty nesters and don't need that much room. We also haven't been driving our Rav4 that much - we've averaged only a couple of thousand miles each of the last few years so don't want to put a lot of money into a subcompact SUV that will primarily be driven sparingly around town and mostly on a few road trips a year. We have an electric car for around town driving and a sports car when we have a need for speed. We're retired so no need to commute.

Our Rav4 had the 269 HP V6 and that was perfect as it allowed us to do high speed driving up and over mountains and in the wide spaces near the west coast where we live. Prior to the Rav4, we had a Previa and then an Odyssey, so we went from 138 to 240 and then to 269 HP. It's hard to envision going backwards but the CX-30 is too small and anything else with more power than the Seltos is $20k more.

So a few questions about the Seltos. How is it for extended high speed cruising, like in the 80-90 MPH range including up in the mountains? Any problems with engine overheating when climbing passes and fully loaded? Does 91/93 octane fuel benefit the power output? Is there a known shop that can retune the engine to produce the higher power levels it generates in other applications?

Also, is there any aftermarket support for suspension components, such as higher rate sway bars or chassis stiffening braces? Has anyone changed out the original 235/45-18 tires for 215/50-18?

And lastly, is the grey seating material a normal grey color or does it have shades or tones of beige? If we were to get that color, is it only the seats or are there any interior trim pieces that are also grey?

Thanks for any help and answers you can provide!

Hello. We had a third gen Rav4 which was rear ended and totaled during a recent snow event. We're looking to go down in size as we are now empty nesters and don't need that much room. We also haven't been driving our Rav4 that much - we've averaged only a couple of thousand miles each of the last few years so don't want to put a lot of money into a subcompact SUV that will primarily be driven sparingly around town and mostly on a few road trips a year. We have an electric car for around town driving and a sports car when we have a need for speed. We're retired so no need to commute.

Our Rav4 had the 269 HP V6 and that was perfect as it allowed us to do high speed driving up and over mountains and in the wide spaces near the west coast where we live. Prior to the Rav4, we had a Previa and then an Odyssey, so we went from 138 to 240 and then to 269 HP. It's hard to envision going backwards but the CX-30 is too small and anything else with more power than the Seltos is $20k more.

So a few questions about the Seltos. How is it for extended high speed cruising, like in the 80-90 MPH range including up in the mountains? Any problems with engine overheating when climbing passes and fully loaded? Does 91/93 octane fuel benefit the power output? Is there a known shop that can retune the engine to produce the higher power levels it generates in other applications?

Also, is there any aftermarket support for suspension components, such as higher rate sway bars or chassis stiffening braces? Has anyone changed out the original 235/45-18 tires for 215/50-18?

And lastly, is the grey seating material a normal grey color or does it have shades or tones of beige? If we were to get that color, is it only the seats or are there any interior trim pieces that are also grey?

Thanks for any help and answers you can provide!

Empty nesters and retired, awesome and congrats! In October we actually bought our first Toyota 2021 Rav 4. We were really interested in Seltos EX but really haven’t been available and certainly not for 5k over sticker. Anyway still may get a Seltos in 2022-23. We are very interested in Electronic vehicles in near future but not certain of which brand to buy. Along the way in considering the Seltos EX we also looked at CX30 but quickly rules that out. Would you consider Mazda CX-5?

 

[NumbNuts]

Hello. We had a third gen Rav4 which was rear ended and totaled during a recent snow event. We're looking to go down in size as we are now empty nesters and don't need that much room. We also haven't been driving our Rav4 that much - we've averaged only a couple of thousand miles each of the last few years so don't want to put a lot of money into a subcompact SUV that will primarily be driven sparingly around town and mostly on a few road trips a year. We have an electric car for around town driving and a sports car when we have a need for speed. We're retired so no need to commute.

Our Rav4 had the 269 HP V6 and that was perfect as it allowed us to do high speed driving up and over mountains and in the wide spaces near the west coast where we live. Prior to the Rav4, we had a Previa and then an Odyssey, so we went from 138 to 240 and then to 269 HP. It's hard to envision going backwards but the CX-30 is too small and anything else with more power than the Seltos is $20k more.

So a few questions about the Seltos. How is it for extended high speed cruising, like in the 80-90 MPH range including up in the mountains? Any problems with engine overheating when climbing passes and fully loaded? Does 91/93 octane fuel benefit the power output? Is there a known shop that can retune the engine to produce the higher power levels it generates in other applications?

Also, is there any aftermarket support for suspension components, such as higher rate sway bars or chassis stiffening braces? Has anyone changed out the original 235/45-18 tires for 215/50-18?

And lastly, is the grey seating material a normal grey color or does it have shades or tones of beige? If we were to get that color, is it only the seats or are there any interior trim pieces that are also grey?

Thanks for any help and answers you can provide!

I've owned (2) of them I upgraded to the SX Turbo 2021. I do nothing but highway driving mostly averaging 80 mph. I think it's a fine ride at that speed. I would stick with the mfg tires. I changed out mfg tires with a new car before for larger ones and it was a costly mistake. My SX turbo has the dark grey interior, no shades of beige. Look at the excellent YouTube review of the 2021 Seltos SX Turbo by SavageGeese.

 

[Old Car Nut]

I have a Seltos with 30K on it. Never had an issue with mountains (Blue Ridge and Smoky Mountains) The turbo model has all the pep I need. Note on octane. With this type of vehicle (and others) the system is programed and tuned for 87 octane. What many don't realize is the higher the octane the quicker the burn. The PCU doesn't know what octane is burning and in fact, the vehicle may run like crap with a higher octane. Missfires, knock, skips, lower power. I assure you that these facts are true and the car is designed/engineered for a certain octane level for performance, mileage, and power. I am a retired Molecular Chemist and have actually did some research on this exact subject. If you'd like, and I can find it, I can send some papers I co-authored on the subject. Thanks

My understanding is that while there are a lot of caveats, high octane fuels burn more evenly/slowly which helps prevent pre-ignition.

Combustion Basics: How Does Fuel Make a Difference?

We expose the truth behind whether or not the quality of fuel you use can make a difference in how your car performs.

www.motortrend.com

.

which says:

"Fuel with an 87 octane rating burns more quickly while higher-octane fuels burn more slowly. In engines designed for standard unleaded fuel, efficiency and performance is optimized for 87 octane and could actually perform worse with higher-octane fuel since the burn rate is slower."

As long as the base chemistry in the fuel is the same, the differences which cause higher octane numbers typically make the fuel harder to ignite and to burn more evenly. This helps especially at low RPMs and high load, which is when pinging/preignition typically occurs. I believe that once you get into race fuels, with an extreme example being alcohol or nitro based fuels like dragsters use, burn rates aren't comparable to gas.

But be that as it may, it's good to know that you've had good experiences in the Blue Ridge and Smoky Mountains. We've never been there but am hoping to get there soon. I know that out here in the Rockies, there's a take-no-prisoners attitude on a lot of the mountain passes and we're fans of just following along. There have been many times we've experienced 80-90 MPH traffic on 6% uphill gradients, but making that kind of power out of a 1.6 liter means a lot of heat to dissipate through the oil and coolant.

 

[Old Car Nut]

Empty nesters and retired, awesome and congrats! In October we actually bought our first Toyota 2021 Rav 4. We were really interested in Seltos EX but really haven’t been available and certainly not for 5k over sticker. Anyway still may get a Seltos in 2022-23. We are very interested in Electronic vehicles in near future but not certain of which brand to buy. Along the way in considering the Seltos EX we also looked at CX30 but quickly rules that out. Would you consider Mazda CX-5?

Thanks! Both retirement and empty nesting has been awesome!

We looked at the CX-30 and it's too small, both in the back seat and in the cargo area. Our Rav is just nine inches longer and a couple of inches wider than a Seltos and it just feels too big for 99% of our needs, that 1% being hauling a seven foot Christmas tree home every year inside the cargo area. We brought two medium sized luggages to all of our test drives to see if they could fit into the back cargo area behind the second row seats and of the Seltos competitors, the CX-30 couldn't accommodate them laying flat, and the Crosstrek required slamming the hatch down hard on the luggage to close. The Seltos swallowed them both fine. In the next step up into luxury subcompact SUVs, space is just as tight in the XC-40, X1/X2, and Q3.

The CX-5 is basically the same size as our Rav4 and we really want to downsize. We purchased an electric Smart car 4 1/2 years ago that has been our main vehicle for driving around, and it has really altered our perceptions of how much space we need. We do Costco runs all the time in it, and people are constantly amazed at how much stuff the Smart car can swallow with both of us in it. It has also been amazingly easy to drive around in traffic, and parking in even the tightest spaces is absolutely a breeze. The times my wife had to drive the Rav in place of the Smart car, she always complained about just how large it is and how much harder it is to maneuver around. And to think that before the Rav, she primarily drove an Odyssey that was almost 20 inches longer!

So the Seltos is really the perfect sized vehicle for us. Large enough to be able to comfortably accommodate our kids if we needed - I'm 6' tall and my son is 6'1" - but also not too large when a majority of the time it is just my wife and me. It gives her the higher seating position she prefers, gives us the smaller footprint that makes our urban maneuvering easier, but also has more than enough space to carry everything we can imagine we'd need when road tripping.

I think the really good electric vehicles, with solid state batteries, are about five years away, and the charging infrastructure in much of the intermountain west is probably about another five years away from that. There are still too many far-out-there places that currently don't have adequate charging infrastructure for an EV to comfortably road trip.

 

[Old Car Nut]

I've owned (2) of them I upgraded to the SX Turbo 2021. I do nothing but highway driving mostly averaging 80 mph. I think it's a fine ride at that speed. I would stick with the mfg tires. I changed out mfg tires with a new car before for larger ones and it was a costly mistake. My SX turbo has the dark grey interior, no shades of beige. Look at the excellent YouTube review of the 2021 Seltos SX Turbo by SavageGeese.

I've always had a set of winter tires for at least one of our cars, and that's despite living in the Seattle area where it snows maybe a couple of times each winter, at most. But the all weather tires coming out are making that less of a need. So the thought was to just swap them out for one tire we could drive all year round and in the snow that we would have on the ground for maybe five to ten days a year.

I put the Michelin Cross Climates on my daughter's BMW 320i X-Drive and they worked great in our recent snowstorm, as well as being quiet and grippy during the summers. From all my years of track driving, and from owning a Miata for five years, I've come to really appreciate now much better a narrower tire feels outside of being used on a track-specific car which has levels of shock control well beyond anything available on other than a dedicated sports car. For me, a narrower tire allows the sidewalls to be more perpendicular to the tread, which increases on center feel and steering responsiveness, and the lower unsprung weight of that narrower tire allows the suspension to better control the wheel. It's also why I asked about suspension adjustability - running a bit more negative camber can allow a narrower tire to approach or exceed the grip levels of a wider tire, albeit at the expensive of a bit of faster tread wear. But for us, that seems like a worthwhile compromise. The narrower tire will also be more resistant to hydroplaning on the freeway, and we get a lot of rain up here where we live.

A 215/50-18 is almost exactly the same circumference as the stock 235/45-18's, and the 215's fit on a 7.5" wide rim with nearly vertical sidewalls. So I'll probably buy the tires ahead of time and swap them out right away. But whoa! Tires are expensive now! About a thousand bucks altogether just to buy them.

 

[Driven1]

Thanks! Both retirement and empty nesting has been awesome!

We looked at the CX-30 and it's too small, both in the back seat and in the cargo area. Our Rav is just nine inches longer and a couple of inches wider than a Seltos and it just feels too big for 99% of our needs, that 1% being hauling a seven foot Christmas tree home every year inside the cargo area. We brought two medium sized luggages to all of our test drives to see if they could fit into the back cargo area behind the second row seats and of the Seltos competitors, the CX-30 couldn't accommodate them laying flat, and the Crosstrek required slamming the hatch down hard on the luggage to close. The Seltos swallowed them both fine. In the next step up into luxury subcompact SUVs, space is just as tight in the XC-40, X1/X2, and Q3.

The CX-5 is basically the same size as our Rav4 and we really want to downsize. We purchased an electric Smart car 4 1/2 years ago that has been our main vehicle for driving around, and it has really altered our perceptions of how much space we need. We do Costco runs all the time in it, and people are constantly amazed at how much stuff the Smart car can swallow with both of us in it. It has also been amazingly easy to drive around in traffic, and parking in even the tightest spaces is absolutely a breeze. The times my wife had to drive the Rav in place of the Smart car, she always complained about just how large it is and how much harder it is to maneuver around. And to think that before the Rav, she primarily drove an Odyssey that was almost 20 inches longer!

So the Seltos is really the perfect sized vehicle for us. Large enough to be able to comfortably accommodate our kids if we needed - I'm 6' tall and my son is 6'1" - but also not too large when a majority of the time it is just my wife and me. It gives her the higher seating position she prefers, gives us the smaller footprint that makes our urban maneuvering easier, but also has more than enough space to carry everything we can imagine we'd need when road tripping.

I think the really good electric vehicles, with solid state batteries, are about five years away, and the charging infrastructure in much of the intermountain west is probably about another five years away from that. There are still too many far-out-there places that currently don't have adequate charging infrastructure for an EV to comfortably road trip.

 

[Driven1]

For me, I think your observations are spot on. Additional the CX-30 clincher was that the passenger seat sat so low. Not adjustable. Wish that passenger seats were adjustable in height and similar options to drivers seats in most any vehicle.
I do feel the Rav is much bigger than what we were looking for. The Seltos has just been unavailable. So, went for the Rav when another customer bailed on a deal. We do like the overall feel and handling but still have interest in the Seltos as our second vehicle.
Did you actually buy a Seltos yet? If and when you do would love to know your thoughts about it after actually driving it regularly. Interested in the Seltos EX and possibly S. Can’t do the LX because need to attach cross bars for kayaks. Hesitant of putting .kayaks on the Rav 4 and Seltos. For long trips when secured kayaks on roof of Kia Soul with Thule J Hooks the hood would get damaged and scuffed. So, need to find a way, when long distance traveling, to secure kayaks north to south without causing damage. If you any insight to this that would be great.
Again, let us know how the Seltos goes when you purchase one, if not already.

 

[ALAP]

My understanding is that while there are a lot of caveats, high octane fuels burn more evenly/slowly which helps prevent pre-ignition.

Combustion Basics: How Does Fuel Make a Difference?

We expose the truth behind whether or not the quality of fuel you use can make a difference in how your car performs.

www.motortrend.com

.

which says:

"Fuel with an 87 octane rating burns more quickly while higher-octane fuels burn more slowly. In engines designed for standard unleaded fuel, efficiency and performance is optimized for 87 octane and could actually perform worse with higher-octane fuel since the burn rate is slower."

As long as the base chemistry in the fuel is the same, the differences which cause higher octane numbers typically make the fuel harder to ignite and to burn more evenly. This helps especially at low RPMs and high load, which is when pinging/preignition typically occurs. I believe that once you get into race fuels, with an extreme example being alcohol or nitro based fuels like dragsters use, burn rates aren't comparable to gas.

But be that as it may, it's good to know that you've had good experiences in the Blue Ridge and Smoky Mountains. We've never been there but am hoping to get there soon. I know that out here in the Rockies, there's a take-no-prisoners attitude on a lot of the mountain passes and we're fans of just following along. There have been many times we've experienced 80-90 MPH traffic on 6% uphill gradients, but making that kind of power out of a 1.6 liter means a lot of heat to dissipate through the oil and coolant.

The article is correct and so are you. I really need to read what I typed before submitting. Should have said higher octane burns less quickly....................................THIS is what retirement did to me!!! LOL. I will admit, winter of 2021, there was a fair amount of snow in the Smokies. I locked the AWD, displayed the transmission temp on the dash, and slipped it into "manual" and drove up a section in 2nd gear. Everything went fine. Since there no highways so to speak through these mountains, I didn't experience "high" speeds.

 

[Old Car Nut]

For me, I think your observations are spot on. Additional the CX-30 clincher was that the passenger seat sat so low. Not adjustable. Wish that passenger seats were adjustable in height and similar options to drivers seats in most any vehicle.
I do feel the Rav is much bigger than what we were looking for. The Seltos has just been unavailable. So, went for the Rav when another customer bailed on a deal. We do like the overall feel and handling but still have interest in the Seltos as our second vehicle.
Did you actually buy a Seltos yet? If and when you do would love to know your thoughts about it after actually driving it regularly. Interested in the Seltos EX and possibly S. Can’t do the LX because need to attach cross bars for kayaks. Hesitant of putting .kayaks on the Rav 4 and Seltos. For long trips when secured kayaks on roof of Kia Soul with Thule J Hooks the hood would get damaged and scuffed. So, need to find a way, when long distance traveling, to secure kayaks north to south without causing damage. If you any insight to this that would be great.
Again, let us know how the Seltos goes when you purchase one, if not already.

We're going to put a thousand bucks down at two separate dealerships to see which one gets their factory order "picked up" first. We'll then cancel the other order. We're doing this with full disclosure to both dealers of what we are doing. We should be doing this within the next few hours, or by tomorrow at the latest. It's fun times to be buying a new car!

 

[Old Car Nut]

The article is correct and so are you. I really need to read what I typed before submitting. Should have said higher octane burns less quickly....................................THIS is what retirement did to me!!! LOL. I will admit, winter of 2021, there was a fair amount of snow in the Smokies. I locked the AWD, displayed the transmission temp on the dash, and slipped it into "manual" and drove up a section in 2nd gear. Everything went fine. Since there no highways so to speak through these mountains, I didn't experience "high" speeds.

My first real experience was back in the middle 90's, with a Toyota Previa. That was RWD with an open diff so I thought it wouldn't be good, but I got dedicated tires, I think at that time they were the Yokohama Guardex 600, and went literally everywhere we wanted to go without any trouble. Since then, I used Blizzaks, and most recently the Altimax Arctic series. So I've experienced the studless winter tires and studdable winter compound tires, and I actually prefer the studdable tires for the limited snow we get around here. They also wear much better so I have no worries installing them when the roads first can get icy, in later November, and leaving them on until March. The Blizzak wore pretty fast - I got less than 10k miles on them before the compound wore through, but the Altimax Arctics still look like new and still perform like new with 15k miles on them. In deep snow, I think they're better than the Blizzak, but on glare ice they are noticeably not as good. But we rarely get the glare ice conditions. The Altimax Arctics were also way less squirmy driving at freeway speeds in the dry.

I'm hoping that we can do with the all weather tires that are out there now, specifically the Michelin Cross Climate II. I think it'll offer enough traction for us, especially since we don't ski and wouldn't really do much mountain driving in the winter. We're way more into hiking from late spring through the fall.